After years of on-again off-again interest, WINA is reporting that Charlottesville City Council formally adopted a downtown noise ordinance last night. It starts at 10pm Sunday through Thursday, and midnight on Friday and Saturday night.
News and meta-news about Charlottesville, VA, since 2001.
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Police announced this afternoon that their investigation into what was initially believed to be a fatal fire on Rugby Avenue is now a homicide investigation. #
The Virginia Supreme Court has denied George Huguely’s appeal. His second-degree murder conviction will stand, WRIC reports. #
In a carefully worded story, and not citing specific sources, WTVR reports that forensic evidence belonging to Jesse Matthew Jr., the main suspect in the disappearance of Hannah Graham, matches forensic evidence collected during the investigation of Morgan Harrington’s 2009 murder. #
In the wake of Hannah Graham’s disappearance, and the evidence that came from private security footage, city officials are revisiting the question of installing security cameras on the downtown mall. #
Both Charlottesville Registrar Sheri Iachetta and former Electoral Board member Stephanie Commander have turned themselves in to the police on
foursix and four felony counts of embezzlement, respectively. #Ten years ago, the National Institutes of Health budget doubled and schools like the University of Virginia built massive new research facilities. A decade later, those buildings remain largely underutilized. NPR visits UVA in this story on the effect of federal binge and spurge spending in the sciences. #
In 2012, Council approved a new student housing complex on West Main—now some council members are questioning whether what they were shown matches what was built. #
The Architectural Review Board has approved a bike-themed mural on West Market, below the McGuffey Art Center, although at least one member expressed concerns that it might look like the bicyclists were riding away from Charlottesville’s downtown. #
City Police Chief Tim Longo is meeting with city leaders to work on protocols regarding the use of military surplus police weapons in Charlottesville. #
A 100-year-old Colonnades resident received military honors for her service in the WWII Women’s Army Corps #
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What a useless law. It does nothing but harm to downtown businesses. Does the law say how early in the morning the ban is lifted?
I for one have lived downtown in the past, and I’ve never been bothered by the late night entertainment. I have however been woken by a jackhammer at 6:00am.
I disagree, I think this law makes perfect sense. When the Jewish Mother was around, they had bands playing upstairs quite loud, with the windows open, well past midnight. Of course the dozens of people who live on the mall complained, but nothing was done at the time, and the Jewish Mother went out of business for unrelated reasons. While no restaraunt does this sort of thing at the moment, there was until yesterday absolutely nothing keeping it from happening again. Now there is, and so similar problems in the future are avoided.
it was perfectly said to me just yesterday in fact. charlottesville has hundreds of quiet neighborhoods where nothing happens, and only one downtown. if you want quiet, move, youve got plenty to chose from.
Yeah, and I’m thinking maybe the West Main Street corrider could be a toxic waste zone. Charlottesville has plenty of clean, pollution-free neighborhoods, so if the residents of the West Main Street area don’t like it, they can just move.
That’s a ridiculous suggestion. If your neighborhood had no noise ordinance, and a band set up across the street from you at midnight and started playing, would you just say, “Oh, that’s too bad. Guess I better move to a new neighborhood.” No, you wouldn’t. So why should these people? It’s their neighborhood, they have the right to have at least some semblance of a noise ordinace, considering that the rest of us do.
good point, but is downtown just another “neighborhood”?
Downtown didn’t have a noise ordinance because it is a commercial district. My neighborhood does and always has because it is a residential district. It seems to me that if you want to run a nightclub or a bar or whatever, you should have a place to do it. Its not like the people who moved downtown didn’t know that there was no noise ordinance. Its not that they should move away, they shouldnt have moved there in the first place.
If you move next door to a toxic waste dump, and you knew it was there, should you insist that the government pick it up and move it somewhere else?
Ofcourse not, you knew what you were getting into.
Basically, I’m assuming this only covers downtown, and there are other areas that dont have this ordinance. This means that businesses that used to operate downtown will be forced to move to those areas, accelerating the already serious problem of “downtown decay” that has plauged the mall and main st. for some time now.
You have very good points and I would normally agree with you, but the thing that you’re overlooking is that Downtown is not like most other commercial districts. There are a large number of people living there. No one lives in Fashion Square Mall, and no one lives in Barracks Road Shopping Center, so it makes sense that there is no noise ordinance there. However, people do live Downtown, so I believe that they deserve at least some semblance of a noise ordinance. The ordinance takes into account the environment by kicking in later on Friday and Saturday nights, and it doesn’t overlap with any regular events Downtown that are already in place, as far as I know. Thus it seems to be nicely unintrusive while protecting Downtown residents from potential annoyances like what used to happen at the Jewish Mother.
What you said really doesn’t change the fact that the people that live downtown (i.e. on the mall) knew what they were doing when they moved there. It’s a comercial area first and foremost, and if people want to live there, that’s fine too, but it makes no sense to then force the businesses to adapt to the residents. Furthermore, the quiet hours start on 10:00pm Sun-Th and 12:00am F,Sat. Personally, I think those should at least be two hours later, so that on friday and saturday, Millers can play til closing.
And to reiterate what Lars said, in the short time I lived downtown, I had never been kept awake by bands and the like, but I had been worken up by various pieces of machinery before 9am.
ben.c
I used to, and like Downtown Charlottesville it is mixed use Heaven (or Hell, depending on your perspective). Bars and clubs next to apartments, people parking everywhere, people passing out on your door stoop, you name it. Believe me, Downtown Charlottesville has NOTHING on a place like Georgetown (or the French Quarter, which also has a lot of residential abodes), and I don’t recall people there ever really complaining much about the noise, which on a Monday would drown out C’ville on its rowdiest Saturday night.
The bottom line is, people usually choose to live in such an area because it’s a hip-happening-now kind of place. You take the bitter (noise, trash, parking hell, etc) with the sweet (convenience, night life, etc), and you roll with it to make the best of it.
Except, apparently, here. It’s a shame, and it’s why the Downtown Mall – for the most part – rolls up the brick pavers at around 9 on most nights.
I am curious to see how the City plans to deal with this new ordinance on New Year’s Eve. I imagine they’ll either look the other way, or grant an exception to First Night. Either way, you can be sure that in this town somebody will whine about the noise if it continues past the specified time.
I think that a lot of people miss the importance of mixed-use. A lot of people believe that business districts should be for business, and residental for residental. This is the design philosophy that the 60s, 70s and 80s brought us. Then we wondered why our downtowns had gone to hell. Mixed-use is the ideal way to ensure a healthy area, as most towns were well aware of right up until the 50s-ish. The school of thought is the same one that tells farmers not to plant just one crop in their fields, or network admins not to put everything on one uber-powerful server rather than on a dozen separate machines.
Consequently, the attitude that downtown should only be for businesses, and that no allowance should be made for residents, is really quite short-sighted. Inevitably, whether in 5 or 50 years, downtowns will suffer again, as ours did in the 80s. Without residents, it will be a ghost town. Residents not only provide a customer base, but they provide bodies, which help prevents crime, decay, the I-don’t-go-there-because-nobody’s-there mentality, and much more.
I’m sure that there’s a City Planning major that knows a lot more about this than I do, but that’s my brain dump, anyhow.
What you said really doesn’t change the fact that the people that live downtown (i.e. on the mall) knew what they were doing when they moved there.
People grossly outnumber businesses Downtown, and have done so as long as the area has been around. Many people have lived downtown longer than most Downtown businesses have even existed (like Mike Williams), so as far as I’m concerned they have just as much claim to the area as businesses do. Like Lars, you’re overlooking that Downtown isn’t like other commercial districts because most other commercial districts don’t have people living in them.
It’s a comercial area first and foremost, and if people want to live there, that’s fine too, but it makes no sense to then force the businesses to adapt to the residents.
Read Waldo’s post on this thread, because it explains very well why there should be people living downtown. The large number of business owners and customers who live Downtown have been a core part of why Downtown has been so successful. Downtown is a commercial district for legal convenience, not because it fits into some sort of mold the way Fashion Square Mall does. Thus it is extremely unfair to just ignore the very reasonable desire of the residents who live there to not be kept up until all hours by loud noise just because they live in a commercial district. In addition, no business has to adapt, since none of them are doing anything that will violate this law. So it’s no skin off the businesses’ back.
And to reiterate what Lars said, in the short time I lived downtown, I had never been kept awake by bands and the like
And to reiterate what I said to Lars, it’s happened before, and just because it isn’t happening now, doesn’t mean it can’t happen again. Thus it’s very reasonable to protect against it happening again.
but I had been worken up by various pieces of machinery before 9am.
Depending on when the noise ordinance becomes inactive, it may very well protect against that as well.
That jack hammer was at 7:00am and I worked from 6:00pm to 1:00am at the time. So that was the same as a “normal” person being woken up in the middle of the night. Not everyone follows the same schedule, and if something is legal at one time, it should be legal at another. Its similar to the curfew, which many here are against. It is legal for young people to be out in the daytime but not at night? Thats like saying “Its illegal to drive drunk at night, but feel free to drive drunk in the daylight hours!”
I havent read the law, but I know that most noise ordinances have a clause for construction. So sadly we’ll all still be woken up at 7am by heavy equipment.
Somehow Charlottesville has gotten by for what? Over a hundred years without a noise ordinance downtown? People have been born and died without a law being passed. I know a lot of residents support the law, but do we really need it?
I dont live downtown, so its not my concern. But I do frequent businesses downtown, so I’ve got my own bias.
All of you who disagree with me… do you live downtown? Are you kept up at night? So far I’ve seen one other person with a complaint, and it was about heavy equipment in the morning as well, not music at night. If these people are complaining about it, why wasnt a law passed years ago? I thought the major impetus was businesses downtown that had their customers scared away by unsavory mall musicians, which is a totally different problem IMHO.
Not everyone follows the same schedule, and if something is legal at one time, it should be legal at another. Its similar to the curfew, which many here are against. It is legal for young people to be out in the daytime but not at night? Thats like saying “Its illegal to drive drunk at night, but feel free to drive drunk in the daylight hours!”
I follow your logic, but I disagree. There are plainly some actions that are acceptable in the daytime but not at night, based on the majority of society’s method of functioning. For example, it should be legal for telephone solicitors to call during normal living hours. But not at 3am. And it should be legal for a churchbells to toll the hour in the day. But not at 4am. People should be allowed to have parties in my apartment building. But not loud ones until 2am.
The problem with your logic is the blanket statement that time-based restrictions on activities are wrong. But this simply doesn’t apply, given that the vast majority of people are asleep in the hours between 12am and 5am. This is evidenced by anybody who has worked as a DJ or a 7-11 clerk, or to anybody that has driven around town at 2:30 in the morning. So it’s only normal that our laws would reflect those habits in order to permit people to sleep during traditional sleeping hours.
All of you who disagree with me… do you live downtown? Are you kept up at night?
I was when I lived on South Street. Now that I live on First Street (several blocks farther from Main), noise is not a problem. Loud music from the Jewmom could be plainly heard. The South Street brewery was a serious problem when they opened. I moved shortly thereafter, not coincidentally.
yeah, you moved. that’s what people do in cities when it’s too noisy.
I think alot of “should” and “shouldn’t” is being thrown around in a situation where lifestyle means far too much. were this tokyo, it would be alot easier to play lars’s anti-time restriction card and win – though I’m fully on board with that concept. It’s been a long time since I was last an all-hours-of-the-night type but I would like to live in a world where if my lifestyle flipflopped and I had to be that way again, I could live normally. I want 24-hour living available everywhere, and I’ll gladly deal with having to move myself away from noise to get it. in many places you can have that, and this isn’t one of them.
it’s that uncomfortable population level inbetween the smaller, less organized, often blue-collar work-all-night small town built around a mill or factory, and the bustling midsize to large place that can actually support an all-night business. in either of those places, there are parts of town where the noise goes on all night and it’s just your own damn problem if you can’t deal with living next to it.
It’s a time when a group can raise a stink about something and get what they want and then they’ll move to the fancier part of town and things will change back. as charlottesville grows, a noise ordinance downtown cannot survive. will not. for the time being, enough people felt like they needed one for it to actually happen..